Chainstay rant

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12/27/2017 9:09 AM
Edited Date/Time: 12/27/2017 5:07 PM

I just looked at the new BSD alvx frame on their website, noticed the chainstay length for the 20.6tt is only 12.5"!! To me that is a crazy short rear end. As we know modern street frames seem to keep getting shorter cs length each year.. I rode a friends fit frame which was a 21.25tt with a 13.1 chain stay and i still felt like the rear end was too short.. my opinion but he didnt have that frame for long because he kept looping out on mannys and t-taps. Personal preferance but i feel if i had my back wheel not even slammed at 12.5" ,id need like 160 or 165mm crank arms at the most. Funny how they keep chiseling more metal from frames but prices stay the same, just kidding lol but really whats next? The new 13.5cs is gonna change industry standard set marks to 12.5"? Crazy stuff

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12/27/2017 9:24 AM

I think that Cs lengths are getting shorter. There are a lot of new street frames with below 13 inch chainstays

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Hmmm

12/27/2017 9:27 AM

To be honest, although it definitely does make a difference, most of the fussiness about frame geometry seems to just be an excuse for people who have shit technique, no patience and no ability to stick at something they find hard.

Just my 2 cents...

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12/27/2017 9:38 AM

It seems thats the way its going, but for me as a taller bigger guy, I think 13.75ish is where I'll stay. Hell Billy Perry's Voyager setup right now is 12.5" in the back. That frame is probably super responsive.

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12/27/2017 12:19 PM

The gay part about these frames is you probably can’t run a 30 tooth sprocket

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12/27/2017 12:59 PM

Man , I’ve run 13” and went back to 13.5 slammed ( so about 13.75 currently ) and holy does having a long backend feel a thousand times better for everything . I’ve had a mix of frames , I don’t think I’ll ever go below 13.25 - so I can run my wheel at 13.5 . Seriously way better than a twitchy back end .

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12/27/2017 1:24 PM

p1p1092 wrote:

To be honest, although it definitely does make a difference, most of the fussiness about frame geometry seems to just be an excuse for people who have shit technique, no patience and no ability to stick at something they find hard.

Just my 2 cents...

I agree with this...

I hate short rear ends, mine in 13.5" slammed but probably at like 13.75" right now... but I think the short chainstays are stupid.... I like tall front ends and longer rear ends... I love it, perfect for me...

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12/27/2017 5:01 PM

Mine is 13.75 slammed but i wish it was 13.5 or somewhere inbetween.. but instead of gettin a whole new frame i kinda want to dremel out the rear dropouts some on my frame. I looked into this topic on the vital bmx site and it seems legit, not much to lose if theres tire/peg clearance. But with heat treated dropouts, part of me doesn't wanna do that. Oh well I might just get a 26t sprocket to try since any other size or chain i use is only slammed for a few sessions before adjustment is needed

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12/28/2017 12:45 AM

Good for short people maybe? It's a bit of a trend, and trends in bmx are a bit of a catch 22. Brands make short chainstays and tell people it makes it better, kids buy it then want even shorter chainstays etc. Same with tall bars, although that seems to have calmed down now.

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12/28/2017 7:57 AM

13.25-13.5 is where it's at, you can change the feel of that by bringing the bb up or down. Don't have to worry about fitting your feet on pegs, nice pop, nice sprocket, and tire clearance, less risk of looping out. The only problem for the kiddies, is you have to try a little harder. They want everything handed to them, that's why scooters are so popular. It's easy. While skateboarding seems to be dying out. Oh well. Times change.

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12/28/2017 5:23 PM

Any way to have a nice short compact frame and still have 33/9 ratio?

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12/28/2017 10:35 PM

I rode a 13.5 frame for a year (realistically it was at like 13.7 cuz chain stretch and all thay) and it was okay. Manuals we're still challenging and all. I've switched to a frame with a 13 rear and and it feels the same. My hops got a bit more pop but it is about the same as the last frame. Overall I think vital is more conservative with their bike setup from what I've noticed.

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12/29/2017 8:29 AM

Coopers25 wrote:

I rode a 13.5 frame for a year (realistically it was at like 13.7 cuz chain stretch and all thay) and it was okay. Manuals we're still challenging and all. I've switched to a frame with a 13 rear and and it feels the same. My hops got a bit more pop but it is about the same as the last frame. Overall I think vital is more conservative with their bike setup from what I've noticed.

Seems to have a lot to do with age as well. There's a lot of older guys on vital right now, and you know what they say " you can't teach an old dog new tricks" lol. It might have to do with whatever geometry you grew up with. I think you tend to stay in that range because that's what's comfortable. I took a long decade plus off from BMX, and when I came back I got a fit Benny complete. I thought I liked the geometry, untill I tried something longer with a mellower head angle, and it just felt perfect. IDK it probably doesn't matter as much as we think it does, but I also think things are getting a bit extreme with the short rear ends.

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12/29/2017 12:05 PM

its a trend, same as bars getting higher and higher, especially in the park scene. look at typical park bars a year ago, youll hardly find any above 8.5 rise. today theres hardly any under 9. i guess you have to decide if its just going by a trend or really getting parts that support your riding and riding goals when buying such parts

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12/29/2017 1:55 PM

wop wrote:

its a trend, same as bars getting higher and higher, especially in the park scene. look at typical park bars a year ago, youll hardly find any above 8.5 rise. today theres hardly any under 9. i guess you have to decide if its just going by a trend or really getting parts that support your riding and riding goals when buying such parts

Yea I hear yeah, until I tried higher bars I realized it was less stress on my back and body for hops and everything else pretty much, I rode a friends bike with 10" rise bars and I personally thought that was a bit much, but I mean if I was like 6 foot Stark I would probably run 10's or 11's. I run 8.75 but I wouldent mind bumping up to 9's or throwing on a top laod stem with some lift, even though I'm not a huge fan of top loaders. But no big deal it's all personal preference, but it is indeed a trend, and it works to move bmx parts and keep bmx companies in business and for all of us who love the shit out of the sport, it is wicked cool to have so much option

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12/29/2017 1:59 PM

eskimojay wrote:

The gay part about these frames is you probably can’t run a 30 tooth sprocket

Idk 28t sprockets are hitting just as much as 25t now adays, even 27 or 30 as well.. So I might assume a good company like BSD would make sure there is room for a 30t sprocket. just cause the rear end is super short doesn't mean the shape and bends of the chainstay wouldent allow for a bigger sprocket. for a while 25t was like the ultimate go-to when micro gearing became popular, but now since rear ends on frames are shortening up that causes a lot of cranks to be less than 175mm to have peg/foot clearance. I think I may have seen a few completes from the Sunday bmx line that come stock with a 30t sprocket, and they seem to have shorter rear ends as well

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12/30/2017 8:21 AM
Edited Date/Time: 12/30/2017 8:22 AM

From experience, most modern street frames have about 1-2mm of clearance for a 28t sprocket.

I've rode a bunch of frames and found that I enjoyed 12.7" for fakie manuals, and 13.5" for forwards manuals. My new frame is a 13" so I'm going to run around 13.25 and hopefully get the best of both worlds. I personally don't ride trails or transition(properly) so I'm not as worried about stability as I am being comfortable with my trick sets and being able to huck my bike around easily.

Everyone has their own preference wink

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12/30/2017 8:37 AM
Edited Date/Time: 12/30/2017 8:45 AM

eskimojay wrote:

The gay part about these frames is you probably can’t run a 30 tooth sprocket

Shredkink9 wrote:

Idk 28t sprockets are hitting just as much as 25t now adays, even 27 or 30 as well.. So I might assume a good company like BSD would make sure there is room for a 30t sprocket. just cause the rear end is super short doesn't mean the shape and bends of the chainstay wouldent allow for a bigger sprocket. for a while 25t was like the ultimate go-to when micro gearing became popular, but now since rear ends on frames are shortening up that causes a lot of cranks to be less than 175mm to have peg/foot clearance. I think I may have seen a few completes from the Sunday bmx line that come stock with a 30t sprocket, and they seem to have shorter rear ends as well

Actually yeah it does, you can not fit a 30t on a 12.5 rear end. It's not possible, no matter how much you bend, you gotta have clearance for those fat tires. What a terrible combo. I guess it's a good way to get rid of the twitchyness. Now if people didn't care about running fat tires, it might work, but I don't think so, not with a decent chain line anyway. Soon people's tires will be rubbing on thier seat tube, then that will be that.

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