Companies that aren't what they used to be?

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1/13/2018 11:07 PM

After years away from riding it really breaks my heart to learn companies like GT and Haro become a shell of their former selves (for lack of a better term). Growing up we used to always buy and trade them as well as Mongoose and Diamondbacks. I don't know too much about any of the new companies so I would like to know if any of the newer companies had a rise and fall from grace as well.

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1/13/2018 11:29 PM

Haro and Mongoose still make good bikes, mongoose have lots of value for the money, Haro have lots of completes but also still have stuff like the lineage line and re issues of the Haro masters etc, which are killer. I wouldnt say Haro are bad bikes at all, they do have some entry level crap but so does everybody. GT kinda sucks , They still make custom Pro frames but their completes tend to be heavy and department store quality, Id say GT makes a better Mountain bike than BMX these days. Diamond back is pretty much done, Loved my viper back in the day. Asfar as new stuff just avoid Mafia and lower end completes and you should be ok, Theres a lot of new companies out there so its better to ask which of those shine and stand out , Kink, subrosa, BSD, FBM ,T1 , Fiend , we the people , sunday, eastern, lots and lots of great companies out there.

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1/14/2018 12:04 AM

I'd say s&m, odyssey and profile are the only one's that have been around a long time and are still doing well. There's a few early mid school brands still doing OK, like hoffman, standard, fbm, g sport (although they were bought out by odyssey). Loads of the later mid school brands have disappeared, but a few are still going strong, like kink, fit (owned by s&m), shadow, animal, federal etc. T1 are still going but on a small scale. Demolition and volume too.

But, all the old school companies kind of sold out and followed the money. Not just that though. Loads of rider owned companies came about in the early mid school days because everything else was breaking. To put it simply, the well known old school brands built crap bikes, so riders started making their own. Then when bmx lost popularity the older brands moved on to other types of cycling.

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1/14/2018 12:08 AM

Lately it looks like Haro are starting to get back to their former selves. But as far as brand quality goes, faaaaaarrrrr above mongoose. GT kinda seems decent still though, I have a 26” avalanche as a grocery-getter, so apart from the 32-spoke rear wheel holding up 30-40kgs of cat litter and 140lbs of me for 2 miles riding through smooth asphalt and potholes once a week, i dont beat on it that much.

Although the best bet to the quality of the brand is to look what the pros of each company ride. Do they ride the bikes of the company or did they have Mike weld up a Lairdframe for them?

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1/14/2018 12:10 AM

BcBMX80 wrote:

Haro and Mongoose still make good bikes, mongoose have lots of value for the money, Haro have lots of completes but also still have stuff like the lineage line and re issues of the Haro masters etc, which are killer. I wouldnt say Haro are bad bikes at all, they do have some entry level crap but so does everybody. GT kinda sucks , They still make custom Pro frames but their completes tend to be heavy and department store quality, Id say GT makes a better Mountain bike than BMX these days. Diamond back is pretty much done, Loved my viper back in the day. Asfar as new stuff just avoid Mafia and lower end completes and you should be ok, Theres a lot of new companies out there so its better to ask which of those shine and stand out , Kink, subrosa, BSD, FBM ,T1 , Fiend , we the people , sunday, eastern, lots and lots of great companies out there.

GT does have some higher end bmx bikes I dig em...

Mongoose is good at being affordable with nothing super fancy but practicality is king.

Haro has some good stuff as Bc mentioned but they seem to keep holding on to the past.

Redline got some decent offerings just not really promoting.

Diamondback has completely given up bmx

Free agents cheapest full chromoly bmx is 809.00usd

I think dyno got bought by gt...

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1/14/2018 12:18 AM

Yeah I remember fairly recently a sponsored rider for mongoose having a custom frame made and not using mongoose frames. They were my fave as a kid, But once a brand goes megacorporate you can never get your rider owned cred back. With their scales of economy I would love to see the best aftermarket frame they could come up with for $150 or so.

For me Oddysey/Sunday have both gone downhill since a decade ago. They went from my very fave best ever, to just a very good brand.

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1/14/2018 5:19 AM

Beamex wrote:

Yeah I remember fairly recently a sponsored rider for mongoose having a custom frame made and not using mongoose frames. They were my fave as a kid, But once a brand goes megacorporate you can never get your rider owned cred back. With their scales of economy I would love to see the best aftermarket frame they could come up with for $150 or so.

For me Oddysey/Sunday have both gone downhill since a decade ago. They went from my very fave best ever, to just a very good brand.

With that being said what are you current favorite brands...as far as frame makers and parts makers?

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1/14/2018 6:26 AM
Edited Date/Time: 1/19/2018 10:28 AM

I grew up when SE, Redline, Torker, GT, Hutch, JMC, CW, ruled the bmx world. Mongoose was always a juggernaut & they sort of still are. They just shifted their focus from high end to low end. & they are have done an outstanding job with that. Especially with offering an economical viable bike worthy of actual use. But none of them are really relevant any longer. At least not at the level they used to be... which saddens me. But, it is the nature of the beast. My faves now are S&M, Sunday, Odyssey, Profile, & Eastern to name a few.

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1/14/2018 6:36 AM

Craig_Davis wrote:

With that being said what are you current favorite brands...as far as frame makers and parts makers?

I still think the Sunday Soundwave is the best street BMX frame available. I'm just disappointed the famous wave tubing is only available on the Soundwave nowadays and no other models.

Odyssey have similar issues, where it feels like they are trying very hard to reduce costs. The legendary 41 thermal heat treatment process is getting used on less products. They also offer far less colour choices than they once did. They still sell the best cranks for 90% of riders imho and r32's would still be my go to fork if I could have any for free.

I like Primo and Stranger but recently learned the owner is bad about paying his riders. That doesn't change the products themselves (I love their hubs), but just my image of the company.

Colony is another I like for parts. I'm currently running red anodized parts from six different companies. The stem is Colony and its probably best shade of red and the smoothest looking finish on the bike.

The more simple a part is, the less important the brand generally. You could choose the top of the line 7075 sprockets from 20 different companies and get pretty much the same performance from all of them. So you may as well just choose one you like the look of .


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1/14/2018 8:21 AM

Haro, but in a good way. Haro was one of the original and way ahead of their time. Other companies jumped on board which made them work hard to stay on top. As other companies faded away Haro lost their edge and just coasted. In modern times other companies became what Haro once was. They were kind of forced to reinvent themselves and basically start over. Personally I think they are on top of the game again for many reasons but mostly do to selection. They build bikes from begginer completes all the way to top quality pro stuff. Their nostalgia line is insane. Some think they are stuck in the padt. I feel they are filling a void in the market.

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1/14/2018 8:25 AM

Someone told me that most of these companies are made in the same few Taiwanese factories from the same exact materials. I think there are a few small rider owned companies that are made in the USA.

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1/14/2018 8:30 AM

Stixxs wrote:

Haro, but in a good way. Haro was one of the original and way ahead of their time. Other companies jumped on board which made them work hard to stay on top. As other companies faded away Haro lost their edge and just coasted. In modern times other companies became what Haro once was. They were kind of forced to reinvent themselves and basically start over. Personally I think they are on top of the game again for many reasons but mostly do to selection. They build bikes from begginer completes all the way to top quality pro stuff. Their nostalgia line is insane. Some think they are stuck in the padt. I feel they are filling a void in the market.

I remember when Haro came out. They were jumping in when others had a dominant foothold... Redline, SE, Torker, GT, etc... we're killing it. Then, later, they basically took a Torker design & brought it back out as Torker was declining. I like their retro stuff. Really expensive tho. The one thing they didn't have back in the day was different size tt options. If you wanted a Redline Proline, you either rode it large or didn't ride a Proline. It'd be nice if the retro bikes came with differing tt options (don't know that any do... The hutch trickster retro doesn't).

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1/14/2018 8:56 AM

Stixxs wrote:

Haro, but in a good way. Haro was one of the original and way ahead of their time. Other companies jumped on board which made them work hard to stay on top. As other companies faded away Haro lost their edge and just coasted. In modern times other companies became what Haro once was. They were kind of forced to reinvent themselves and basically start over. Personally I think they are on top of the game again for many reasons but mostly do to selection. They build bikes from begginer completes all the way to top quality pro stuff. Their nostalgia line is insane. Some think they are stuck in the padt. I feel they are filling a void in the market.

Mishinn_Control wrote:

I remember when Haro came out. They were jumping in when others had a dominant foothold... Redline, SE, Torker, GT, etc... we're killing it. Then, later, they basically took a Torker design & brought it back out as Torker was declining. I like their retro stuff. Really expensive tho. The one thing they didn't have back in the day was different size tt options. If you wanted a Redline Proline, you either rode it large or didn't ride a Proline. It'd be nice if the retro bikes came with differing tt options (don't know that any do... The hutch trickster retro doesn't).

Haro seems to have a lot of money to sign some of the biggest riders in BMX. They did it back in the day and they continue to do so today.

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1/14/2018 10:15 AM

Flybikes. The Tierra frame I'll never have.

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Scooter kid trying to ride a bike. Instagram: @scootereyn // YouTube: RH MEDIA

1/14/2018 11:04 AM

Stixxs wrote:

Haro, but in a good way. Haro was one of the original and way ahead of their time. Other companies jumped on board which made them work hard to stay on top. As other companies faded away Haro lost their edge and just coasted. In modern times other companies became what Haro once was. They were kind of forced to reinvent themselves and basically start over. Personally I think they are on top of the game again for many reasons but mostly do to selection. They build bikes from begginer completes all the way to top quality pro stuff. Their nostalgia line is insane. Some think they are stuck in the padt. I feel they are filling a void in the market.

Mishinn_Control wrote:

I remember when Haro came out. They were jumping in when others had a dominant foothold... Redline, SE, Torker, GT, etc... we're killing it. Then, later, they basically took a Torker design & brought it back out as Torker was declining. I like their retro stuff. Really expensive tho. The one thing they didn't have back in the day was different size tt options. If you wanted a Redline Proline, you either rode it large or didn't ride a Proline. It'd be nice if the retro bikes came with differing tt options (don't know that any do... The hutch trickster retro doesn't).

Most of these companies came out in the late 70s as did Haro but they focused on bmx racing, hence the term bmx (bicycle motor cross). Bob Haro had a vision for making freestyle, or trick, bikes which then started to dominate bmx into the 80s and beyond.

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1/14/2018 11:07 AM

Stixxs wrote:

Haro, but in a good way. Haro was one of the original and way ahead of their time. Other companies jumped on board which made them work hard to stay on top. As other companies faded away Haro lost their edge and just coasted. In modern times other companies became what Haro once was. They were kind of forced to reinvent themselves and basically start over. Personally I think they are on top of the game again for many reasons but mostly do to selection. They build bikes from begginer completes all the way to top quality pro stuff. Their nostalgia line is insane. Some think they are stuck in the padt. I feel they are filling a void in the market.

Mishinn_Control wrote:

I remember when Haro came out. They were jumping in when others had a dominant foothold... Redline, SE, Torker, GT, etc... we're killing it. Then, later, they basically took a Torker design & brought it back out as Torker was declining. I like their retro stuff. Really expensive tho. The one thing they didn't have back in the day was different size tt options. If you wanted a Redline Proline, you either rode it large or didn't ride a Proline. It'd be nice if the retro bikes came with differing tt options (don't know that any do... The hutch trickster retro doesn't).

BrooklynGoon wrote:

Haro seems to have a lot of money to sign some of the biggest riders in BMX. They did it back in the day and they continue to do so today.

I always wondered how they attracted the talent they did, and do. Obviously your product has to be good but im sure they paid well.

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1/14/2018 11:13 AM

Mishinn_Control wrote:

I remember when Haro came out. They were jumping in when others had a dominant foothold... Redline, SE, Torker, GT, etc... we're killing it. Then, later, they basically took a Torker design & brought it back out as Torker was declining. I like their retro stuff. Really expensive tho. The one thing they didn't have back in the day was different size tt options. If you wanted a Redline Proline, you either rode it large or didn't ride a Proline. It'd be nice if the retro bikes came with differing tt options (don't know that any do... The hutch trickster retro doesn't).

BrooklynGoon wrote:

Haro seems to have a lot of money to sign some of the biggest riders in BMX. They did it back in the day and they continue to do so today.

Stixxs wrote:

I always wondered how they attracted the talent they did, and do. Obviously your product has to be good but im sure they paid well.

Bob haro was the man back in the day and was a great promoter and a fantastic photograper, hence why they all wanted to ride for him.

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1/14/2018 11:51 AM

Stixxs wrote:

Most of these companies came out in the late 70s as did Haro but they focused on bmx racing, hence the term bmx (bicycle motor cross). Bob Haro had a vision for making freestyle, or trick, bikes which then started to dominate bmx into the 80s and beyond.

Actually, if memory serves, Haro didn't actually start making bikes until the early/mid 80's. Like 83 or 84. & their first bikes were built by Torker. Before that the "company", if you could call it that, was started as a parts maker... Particularly number plates. Also, I think Bob Haro was a photographer for bmx Acton back in the day.

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1/14/2018 12:16 PM
Edited Date/Time: 1/14/2018 12:20 PM

Yes, your right. I was one of those people buying the number plates in 1978. The company Haro came out in 1978 selling number plates. Bob Haro was working with Torker to build a bike to do tricks on at this time. He was bored in between races so he learned tricks on his bike which led to the Master in 83. I guess the point i was trying to make was there were companies making bikes before Haro but none of then made freestyle bikes. They were a leader in this regaurds.

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1/14/2018 12:20 PM

Mishinn_Control wrote:

I remember when Haro came out. They were jumping in when others had a dominant foothold... Redline, SE, Torker, GT, etc... we're killing it. Then, later, they basically took a Torker design & brought it back out as Torker was declining. I like their retro stuff. Really expensive tho. The one thing they didn't have back in the day was different size tt options. If you wanted a Redline Proline, you either rode it large or didn't ride a Proline. It'd be nice if the retro bikes came with differing tt options (don't know that any do... The hutch trickster retro doesn't).

BrooklynGoon wrote:

Haro seems to have a lot of money to sign some of the biggest riders in BMX. They did it back in the day and they continue to do so today.

Stixxs wrote:

I always wondered how they attracted the talent they did, and do. Obviously your product has to be good but im sure they paid well.

They dominated he scene back in the day and had the most money to play with. Then Mirra and Nyquist came along and won every X Games medal on Haros. Kids grew up again buying Haros. Today those kids are grown and probably have a soft spot for the company, also I think they still pay the best because they have a TON of models for sale and probably make the most money.

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1/14/2018 2:21 PM

Stixxs wrote:

Yes, your right. I was one of those people buying the number plates in 1978. The company Haro came out in 1978 selling number plates. Bob Haro was working with Torker to build a bike to do tricks on at this time. He was bored in between races so he learned tricks on his bike which led to the Master in 83. I guess the point i was trying to make was there were companies making bikes before Haro but none of then made freestyle bikes. They were a leader in this regaurds.

Yep... You weren't shit without a Haro plate! I had a Torker Maxflire back in the day. LOVED that bike. & it took a beating!

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1/14/2018 2:37 PM

I'm going to say Redline. They've sponsored many of the top names in the sport over the years - Garrett Reynolds, Matt Beringer, Rooftop, Fuzzy Hall - and now they have literally no team. In my opinion, it's pretty lame to sell BMX bikes, but not support a team or the scene in any way.

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1/14/2018 3:08 PM
Edited Date/Time: 1/14/2018 3:09 PM

readybmxer wrote:

Flybikes. The Tierra frame I'll never have.

Which version ? My favorite frame from them too. I still have my V3. One of the best frames they made tbh.

I also miss Superstar they had some nice stuff, luckily they are coming back, cant wait.

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1/14/2018 3:41 PM
Edited Date/Time: 1/14/2018 3:42 PM

I love my Haro SD v2 Frame, and as Dennis Enarson rides it you can be pretty sure it is decent. (and certainly better than I need)

When I was a kid in the 80s I looked up to Dominguez, Wilkerson, Hoffman (Still do), McCoy, Blyther etc. but could never afford a Haro (although I did have a dozen bikes including a GT/Dyno and then a Hoffman in the early 90s).

So when I was looking at a new bikes last year I gave in to nostalgia and treated myself to a custom Haro SDv2 even though I could have bought an equivalent frame for cheaper in a sale...no regrets whatsoever

Top-end bikes from Mongoose/Haro are still decent so if you want one go for it! They will take far more abuse than most of us will put them through.

P.S. 46 here, another old fogey.
P.P.S. A Skyway T/A with Tuff IIs is still my dream bike but I wanted a modern frame from an old school company

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1/14/2018 3:43 PM

Mutiny , I used to ride a joe Simon sinister frame back in the day that frame kicked ass , they used to pump out awesome videos and have a stacked team , I can’t remember the last time I even heard about mutiny

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1/14/2018 4:05 PM

kylecarlson wrote:

I'm going to say Redline. They've sponsored many of the top names in the sport over the years - Garrett Reynolds, Matt Beringer, Rooftop, Fuzzy Hall - and now they have literally no team. In my opinion, it's pretty lame to sell BMX bikes, but not support a team or the scene in any way.

Redline and Free agent are still two of the biggest names in BMX.

Both have and always will be BMX companies, as in racing companies.

As for Redline and a Team? Alise Post rode for redline till last spring I think. She is arguably one of the best BMX riders of all time.


I would have to check for Free agent. Tho I believe both companies have medaled in the Olympics.

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1/14/2018 4:07 PM

Free agent completes I checked out the other day actually look pretty sick

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1/14/2018 5:52 PM

eskimojay wrote:

Mutiny , I used to ride a joe Simon sinister frame back in the day that frame kicked ass , they used to pump out awesome videos and have a stacked team , I can’t remember the last time I even heard about mutiny

Yeah I was going to say, I feel like Mutiny has slowed down. Still one of my favorite companies. I always loved their videos and their team. I haven't had the chance of riding one of their solid frames. They make solid stems too. I think Haro Bikes still makes very solid frames and parts and I think it's awesome to see they make re-issue bikes. I think today the bmx market is diluted with new companies appealing to the younger/cooler crowd of riders setting the older and much more established companies in the back. Even though Dennis Enarson and Chad Kerley both being cool doods and ride for Haro and win major contest events Haro isn't some of the "cooler" crowd's first or second thought.

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1/14/2018 6:00 PM

Guys what about Kink? I think I remember about 5 years ago I was browsing youtube vids and Kink was huge. I never really researched them. WTP I've been hearing about ever since I stopped riding, but again I never really dabbled in either. I think the last bike I bought was a Haro shredder or zippo, and I gave it away to my nephew.

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1/14/2018 6:09 PM

Lol free agent are liked by this crowd? lol. They were heavy junk back in the day, Their completes come from china, they used to anyways. They wiegh a literal shit ton and theres a reason you can buy three free agents for the price of a kink. I mean thier top of the line shit is ok in racing but sane can be said of redline and dk but I've never been very impressed by the street bikes. I tend to think of them as decent entry bikes like lumen etc(150 bucks used ride it till it snaps) They sure seem to do a ton for the sport though. Like a ton. Seem to have a huge team so good on em for that. Being based out of Cali gives them year round riding.

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