Freecoaster riders... couple of questions for youz guyz

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1/27/2020 9:54 AM
Edited Date/Time: 1/27/2020 9:55 AM

For those of you who currently ride freecoasters, what kind do you have and if I could ask how much slack you have and / or what you like, I would love to hear it. I was talking with a guy at a local bike shop and something he said made me wonder. He said' freecoasters have 1/4 to 1/2 a crank of slack and I thought that sounded a little bit like a generalization. And 1/2 crank seems also a bit like an exaggeration ,but maybe some of them do have that much. He was trying to sell me on not having one so.... that was the perspective.

I ride a coaster brake cruiser for normal rides quite a bit al like it. There's definitely not 1/2 crank of slack, but I know it's probably a bit different. Although I do work on tricks with it sometimes.

But obviously there are different hubs on the market and I'm curious how yours is and what you like. And I don't know if the V2 is the only adjustable one.

Thanks guys!!!

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Philippians 1:6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Christ Jesus.

1/27/2020 10:09 AM
Edited Date/Time: 1/27/2020 10:10 AM

you can make them have almost no slack pretty easy. I'd say 1/2 crank of slack is plenty and probably more than full slack on most coasters. there really is no reason to have more than 1/2 a crank slack as you're not going be able accidentally engage more than 180 degrees really.

Clutch V2, max slack is like 120 degree-ish range. (90 degree = 1/4 crank)

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1/27/2020 10:18 AM

What kind of hub do you ride and how do you like it?

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Philippians 1:6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Christ Jesus.

1/27/2020 10:19 AM

Now that i think more about it, The clutch V2 probably barely gets to 90 degrees max slack with its adjuster.

90 degrees is a lot of slack. level pedals to all the way up and down.

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1/27/2020 10:23 AM

Fortyseven wrote:

What kind of hub do you ride and how do you like it?

Clutch V2. its fine. i don;t think its worth the extra money though. I do like female axle bolts and its one of few FC's with them.

Most coasters are the same inside with tiny changes. I had a colony and have used a demolition for a bit both were also fine. just have to take apart to adjust slack. that said, the adjuster on teh clutch breaks pretty easy then you have to take apart to replace it (plastic) or mod it to how much slack you want.

I've just learned to ride it with Max slack.

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1/27/2020 11:11 AM

My Kink Legend came with a 14mm Mission Dispatch Freecoaster Hub. It was/is my first FC so I was a little unsure about slack myself. At first I thought I would prefer having as little slack as possible, having rode a cassette hub for most my life. What I have learned so far though, is that a decent amount of slack makes doing fakie tricks easier. For example, I like to do fakie bunny-hops. The extra slack is necessary when puling up for the hop while rolling fakie, as the cranks rotate forward a bit relatvie to the bike as I pull-up. To little slack would cause the hub to engage while doing that. Having figured that out, I don't mind having a decent amount of slack (45 degrees or more).

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Licensed Desk Jockey

1/27/2020 11:43 AM

I have the clutch v2 from my experience the slack has been random sometimes its 1/4 sometimes its a quarter of a crank or less because that adjustable crap floats around freely, so ive purchased the max slack piece and i hope this solves the problem because i hate engagement

#Celibacy

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old edit

1/27/2020 12:12 PM
Edited Date/Time: 1/27/2020 12:12 PM

OneGuyIlluminatiEye wrote:

I have the clutch v2 from my experience the slack has been random sometimes its 1/4 sometimes its a quarter of a crank or less because that adjustable crap floats around freely, so ive purchased the max slack piece and i hope this solves the problem because i hate engagement

#Celibacy

a few dabs of superglue between the 2 adjuster stacks and you would get the same thing with no float... just saying.

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1/27/2020 12:31 PM

OneGuyIlluminatiEye wrote:

I have the clutch v2 from my experience the slack has been random sometimes its 1/4 sometimes its a quarter of a crank or less because that adjustable crap floats around freely, so ive purchased the max slack piece and i hope this solves the problem because i hate engagement

#Celibacy

jmz313 wrote:

a few dabs of superglue between the 2 adjuster stacks and you would get the same thing with no float... just saying.

Im hoping the max slack piece is smaller and gives more slack

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Testimony and apologies





I want everyone to know that Jesus Christ died on the cross for all of your sins, he went to hell for three days and defeated death and rose from the grave on the 3rd day.






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old edit

1/27/2020 12:35 PM

OneGuyIlluminatiEye wrote:

I have the clutch v2 from my experience the slack has been random sometimes its 1/4 sometimes its a quarter of a crank or less because that adjustable crap floats around freely, so ive purchased the max slack piece and i hope this solves the problem because i hate engagement

#Celibacy

I find that highly unlikely. The only way that could be caused by the adjuster is if the points at the tops of the ramps sat together perfectly, which is just about impossible.

What is actually happening, more than likely, is that the clutch/driver threads are sticky, meaning that the clutch never backs down the thread fully. It moves just enough to stop contacting the clutch face in the hubshell. I have had this happen on multiple coasters because I use a pretty thick grease. Try using a thinner grease in your hub and it'll most likely go away.

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1/27/2020 12:39 PM

OneGuyIlluminatiEye wrote:

I have the clutch v2 from my experience the slack has been random sometimes its 1/4 sometimes its a quarter of a crank or less because that adjustable crap floats around freely, so ive purchased the max slack piece and i hope this solves the problem because i hate engagement

#Celibacy

p1p1092 wrote:

I find that highly unlikely. The only way that could be caused by the adjuster is if the points at the tops of the ramps sat together perfectly, which is just about impossible.

What is actually happening, more than likely, is that the clutch/driver threads are sticky, meaning that the clutch never backs down the thread fully. It moves just enough to stop contacting the clutch face in the hubshell. I have had this happen on multiple coasters because I use a pretty thick grease. Try using a thinner grease in your hub and it'll most likely go away.


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Testimony and apologies





I want everyone to know that Jesus Christ died on the cross for all of your sins, he went to hell for three days and defeated death and rose from the grave on the 3rd day.






instagram
What would Jesus say: I didn't die for you to live like this!

old edit

1/27/2020 1:04 PM

Get the freenight coaster. Infinite slack going reverse and cassette going forward.

I loved my clutch v2 as well. Had it set up for a bit less than a 1/4 crank.

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1/27/2020 1:25 PM

I'm not familiar with that grease but I would suggest using a thinner grease if you want the clutch to move freely. The only thing moving the clutch down the threads after it disengages is its momentum, which doesn't go very far when there's a lot of thick grease in the way. If it really bothers you, I'd suggest a NLGI 1 Moly grease; that way you have far less stiction but also have the extreme pressure/high lubricity capabilities of a moly grease.

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My Sunday Soundwave V3 Build
Insta: @p.gibbons

"You can't educate pork"
- grumpySteve

"Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow! What a Ride!""
- Hunter S. Thompson

1/27/2020 3:23 PM
Edited Date/Time: 1/27/2020 3:25 PM

I have (but seldom run) a spare freecoaster wheel with the Eclat Blind hub. They don't make them anymore because the pawl/rubber band system it uses never caught on, but it's at max slack, about 1/4, if not a tiny bit more.

I prefer this, and I'd think 1/2 a crank of slack is overkill for my style. Anything less than 1/4 makes me feel like I'm on a coaster brake since I guess my feet move around quite a bit in spins.

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1/28/2020 5:37 AM

OneGuyIlluminatiEye wrote:

I have the clutch v2 from my experience the slack has been random sometimes its 1/4 sometimes its a quarter of a crank or less because that adjustable crap floats around freely, so ive purchased the max slack piece and i hope this solves the problem because i hate engagement

#Celibacy

jmz313 wrote:

a few dabs of superglue between the 2 adjuster stacks and you would get the same thing with no float... just saying.

OneGuyIlluminatiEye wrote:

Im hoping the max slack piece is smaller and gives more slack

you also could sand it thinner i'd think, for more slack.

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1/28/2020 8:25 AM

Bulletpup wrote:

Get the freenight coaster. Infinite slack going reverse and cassette going forward.

I loved my clutch v2 as well. Had it set up for a bit less than a 1/4 crank.

Yeah.... I don't think that's going to happen. That hub, while nice, is almost as much as he wants to spend on the entire bike. LOL.

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1/28/2020 9:32 AM

Bulletpup wrote:

Get the freenight coaster. Infinite slack going reverse and cassette going forward.

I loved my clutch v2 as well. Had it set up for a bit less than a 1/4 crank.

I saw a few people get that coaster and hype it up when it came out but then a week later... nothing again.

???

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1/28/2020 12:48 PM

Bulletpup wrote:

Get the freenight coaster. Infinite slack going reverse and cassette going forward.

I loved my clutch v2 as well. Had it set up for a bit less than a 1/4 crank.

jmz313 wrote:

I saw a few people get that coaster and hype it up when it came out but then a week later... nothing again.

???

Its awesome...definitely could be the future if enough people give it a shot.

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1/28/2020 12:52 PM

Bulletpup wrote:

Get the freenight coaster. Infinite slack going reverse and cassette going forward.

I loved my clutch v2 as well. Had it set up for a bit less than a 1/4 crank.

Mishinn_Control wrote:

Yeah.... I don't think that's going to happen. That hub, while nice, is almost as much as he wants to spend on the entire bike. LOL.

It definitely is not a cheap hub but it will come down in price if enough people buy em.

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1/28/2020 8:26 PM

I have a coaster that came on my fit. I'd say I have like a 3/16ish crank slack with 3 slack rings. Coasters are the same for the most part, and you can adjust any coaster with slack rings, the v2 just takes it further.

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1/29/2020 10:50 AM

There are a couple styles with minor differences, packed into the different manufacturers' hubs and maybe tweaked a bit. I have both a KHE-based (from Fit) and Ezra-based (from Salt) hubs, others have mentioned the Clutch or the Planetary. Most of them work the same once installed, only the mechanics and adjustment are different (the Planetary looks different, but I haven't tried one). Mine both adjust slack to about 1/8, 1/4, and maybe 3/8 of a crank (I'm geared at 28:9). If you're used to a coaster brake, the 1/8 or 1/4 crank should feel completely normal.

The KHE/Fit uses shim washers to adjust slack, which seems to be more common. With the Ezra/Salt you switch out a disk with different contours instead. The Salt hub has an added feature where you can flip the disk and the springs so it functions as a cassette or a freecoaster, but it tends to make popping noises when you start cranking because the pawls don't make full contact. The KHE is dead silent and runs more smoothly.

I like the KHE-based better, but the idea of switching back to a cassette is neat, in theory.

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Remember when you could ride all day and not be sore for a week?

1/29/2020 2:12 PM

I currently run the Ezra FC. I use to like having minimal slack, but now I have gotten use to more slack

In the past I have had the old Odyssey Reloader, KHE Geisha, Stolen FC, and they all did the same job for me. I like the Ezra for the weight savings compared to some other FC hubs.

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1/30/2020 8:31 AM

MJbmx wrote:

There are a couple styles with minor differences, packed into the different manufacturers' hubs and maybe tweaked a bit. I have both a KHE-based (from Fit) and Ezra-based (from Salt) hubs, others have mentioned the Clutch or the Planetary. Most of them work the same once installed, only the mechanics and adjustment are different (the Planetary looks different, but I haven't tried one). Mine both adjust slack to about 1/8, 1/4, and maybe 3/8 of a crank (I'm geared at 28:9). If you're used to a coaster brake, the 1/8 or 1/4 crank should feel completely normal.

The KHE/Fit uses shim washers to adjust slack, which seems to be more common. With the Ezra/Salt you switch out a disk with different contours instead. The Salt hub has an added feature where you can flip the disk and the springs so it functions as a cassette or a freecoaster, but it tends to make popping noises when you start cranking because the pawls don't make full contact. The KHE is dead silent and runs more smoothly.

I like the KHE-based better, but the idea of switching back to a cassette is neat, in theory.

I do believe you are correct. There's not a bunch of slack on my cruiser. About an 1/8-1/4 like you say. I didn't turn it over and actually measure it.... LOL.

Does any of you actually use pedal tension by engaging your hub on any tricks? I would think if you ran only a little slack you can ride it a lot like a cassette by engaging your hub when you want pedal tension. If somebody wanted that. Cuz I don't really get how people say you don't have any. It's just not instant and you have to engage. Eh?

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Philippians 1:6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Christ Jesus.

1/30/2020 9:20 AM

Fortyseven wrote:

I do believe you are correct. There's not a bunch of slack on my cruiser. About an 1/8-1/4 like you say. I didn't turn it over and actually measure it.... LOL.

Does any of you actually use pedal tension by engaging your hub on any tricks? I would think if you ran only a little slack you can ride it a lot like a cassette by engaging your hub when you want pedal tension. If somebody wanted that. Cuz I don't really get how people say you don't have any. It's just not instant and you have to engage. Eh?

Pedal pressure will cause the driveside bearing to crush prematurely.

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My Sunday Soundwave V3 Build
Insta: @p.gibbons

"You can't educate pork"
- grumpySteve

"Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow! What a Ride!""
- Hunter S. Thompson

1/30/2020 10:13 AM

Pedal pressure is something you simply give up when going freecoaster. It's there after the slack, but like p1 said, it damages the hub over time because it's not meant to take the pedaling abuse like a cassette can handle. Besides going backwards without pedaling, lack of instant engagement is the second biggest difference between cassettes and coasters, IMO.

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1/30/2020 4:24 PM

readybmxer wrote:

Pedal pressure is something you simply give up when going freecoaster. It's there after the slack, but like p1 said, it damages the hub over time because it's not meant to take the pedaling abuse like a cassette can handle. Besides going backwards without pedaling, lack of instant engagement is the second biggest difference between cassettes and coasters, IMO.

I think it depends on the hub. I've had the KHE for about 2 years, I pedal out of stuff all the time and it never missed a beat. I'm less confident in my newer Ezra, it makes more noise and just feels less reliable. I've seen more complaints about the Clutch, even though it seems popular aftermarket. YMMV

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Remember when you could ride all day and not be sore for a week?

1/30/2020 6:17 PM
Edited Date/Time: 1/30/2020 6:22 PM

MJbmx wrote:

I think it depends on the hub. I've had the KHE for about 2 years, I pedal out of stuff all the time and it never missed a beat. I'm less confident in my newer Ezra, it makes more noise and just feels less reliable. I've seen more complaints about the Clutch, even though it seems popular aftermarket. YMMV

I certainly wouldn't pedal pressure on an Ezra style coaster as you'll very easily damage the pawls or the ratchet ring. I've seen a tooth snapped off an Eclat Blind hub ratchet ring from pedal pressure.

As for a KHE style, the large bearings on the side of the hub are simply not able for large lateral forces. Yes, they're an angular contact bearing(in most hubs anyways) but they're designed more for things that might have a moderate sideload from time to time; not something that has a moderate to high sideload every time it's actuated. Over time, you'll wear excessively on the inward-facing side of the outer race and the outward-facing side of the inner race of the bearing. I have pulled bearings out of an 8 year old coaster that rarely, if ever saw pedal pressure, to find that the driveside had like 1/16" of slop side to side. With pedal pressure, you'd brinell the side of each race instead.

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My Sunday Soundwave V3 Build
Insta: @p.gibbons

"You can't educate pork"
- grumpySteve

"Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow! What a Ride!""
- Hunter S. Thompson

1/31/2020 8:24 AM
Edited Date/Time: 1/31/2020 8:25 AM

OK, BUT, there is pedal pressure and force on the clutch when pedaling forward.

So I'm guessing it's got more to do with how fast you might be going fakie when engaging it for pedal pressure. Which if you're going real fast you're not going to want to do anyways... eh? End up on your back... But if you're going slow and want to pedal out of something..... I guess it would be more force on the clutch than if going from a stop to forward but there again it depends on how much force you're giving it.

I realize you will be relying more on balance most of the time. But you pedal out of some tricks regardless of freecoaster or cassette. At least when you do them slowly like I do right now. LOL.

I was watching some x games last night. It was in Minneapolis I think in 2017 and to me it seemed a majority of riders in the bowl and on the street course, rode freecoasters.........


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Philippians 1:6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Christ Jesus.

1/31/2020 8:36 AM

Fortyseven wrote:

OK, BUT, there is pedal pressure and force on the clutch when pedaling forward.

So I'm guessing it's got more to do with how fast you might be going fakie when engaging it for pedal pressure. Which if you're going real fast you're not going to want to do anyways... eh? End up on your back... But if you're going slow and want to pedal out of something..... I guess it would be more force on the clutch than if going from a stop to forward but there again it depends on how much force you're giving it.

I realize you will be relying more on balance most of the time. But you pedal out of some tricks regardless of freecoaster or cassette. At least when you do them slowly like I do right now. LOL.

I was watching some x games last night. It was in Minneapolis I think in 2017 and to me it seemed a majority of riders in the bowl and on the street course, rode freecoasters.........


The difference between pedalling and pedal pressure is the motion of the wheel. When pedalling, the balls are rolling constantly, which prevents brinelling. When using pedal pressure, the balls are static; which means you're point loading them which causes brinelling. Same as when a headset gets 'indexed'; there's very little relative motion in a headset so when it takes an impact, all of that force is transferred through a number of very small points.

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My Sunday Soundwave V3 Build
Insta: @p.gibbons

"You can't educate pork"
- grumpySteve

"Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow! What a Ride!""
- Hunter S. Thompson

1/31/2020 8:38 AM

I feel the idea of a freecoaster is to never pivot out using pressure though, it’s simply not built to do so.

You definitely don’t wanna engage it going backwards fast, and that’s why the slack exists in the mechanism, to enable the free rolling in reverse.

Of course, you’re right in saying there’s always some amount of pressure pedaling forwards, but from any speed backwards, it’s still more unwanted pressure going back forwards.

In street, the freecoaster scene easily outnumbers the cassette riders, but in the park contest, I can only think of a few in the field... Dennis, Gary, Pat, maybe one or two more. Just depends on the rider’s style really.

In short, I’d say learn to halfcab out properly and use the pressure gently moving forwards on a coaster, it’ll give you a long-lasting hub. There are little techniques you’ll pick up on the more you ride one. Or, get a cassette. XD

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