Odyssey Aerospace Rims

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3/29/2015 9:32 AM

Since I'm sick and have nothing better to do, i went looking at all the bike checks on the Odyssey and Sunday sites.

I came to notice a lot of their riders are using the Aerospace rims. Which I found to be rather strange. I ran that rim in the back and it seriously couldn't handle that very well. It was VERY light, which was fun, but it doesn't exactly take street abuse very well. There may even be a crack forming on the weld inside, but the rim itself is still runnable. I hated lacing it because if you lost the nipple it would get stuck in the center. Which is a minor inconvenience. I'd probably only run it up front.

But it made me wonder really, why do so many of the riders run this rim on that team, when Odyssey makes far superior rims? They do feel good, but are a pain in the ass and come untrue pretty often.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/29/2015 10:46 AM

I'd imagine that rim would hold up fine if you where running like 100 or 110 psi

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3/29/2015 10:51 AM

eskimojay wrote:

I'd imagine that rim would hold up fine if you where running like 100 or 110 psi

What is the reasoning behind this? Wouldn't it be better for the rim to use around 80? Obviously depending on your weight.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/29/2015 10:57 AM

Doesn't Dugan ride them? He lands straight. He's not side loading his rims a huge amount. Hawk runs em too I think. He land nicely and nails tricks.

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3/29/2015 11:19 AM

eskimojay wrote:

I'd imagine that rim would hold up fine if you where running like 100 or 110 psi

MaximusBikes wrote:

What is the reasoning behind this? Wouldn't it be better for the rim to use around 80? Obviously depending on your weight.

No 80 would make the rim more vulnerable to dents from casing big airs , the more rock solid the tire is the more protection for the rim

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3/29/2015 11:19 AM

biggybuggy wrote:

Doesn't Dugan ride them? He lands straight. He's not side loading his rims a huge amount. Hawk runs em too I think. He land nicely and nails tricks.

But then Sean Sexton rides them. We all know that dude goes hard, and if this rim doesn't hold up well for me, i couldn't imagine it would for him. There are others too, like Gary Young. Sure, he does a good bit of bowl riding, but then he goes crazy hard on street and other stuff.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/29/2015 11:21 AM

eskimojay wrote:

I'd imagine that rim would hold up fine if you where running like 100 or 110 psi

MaximusBikes wrote:

What is the reasoning behind this? Wouldn't it be better for the rim to use around 80? Obviously depending on your weight.

eskimojay wrote:

No 80 would make the rim more vulnerable to dents from casing big airs , the more rock solid the tire is the more protection for the rim

But then side loads would be more apparent to the rim? I didn't have any trouble with the denting. I run about 80. I doubt the rim would have much trouble for denting. But the overall strength and trueness of them isn't exactly fantastic..

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/29/2015 12:26 PM

biggybuggy wrote:

Doesn't Dugan ride them? He lands straight. He's not side loading his rims a huge amount. Hawk runs em too I think. He land nicely and nails tricks.

MaximusBikes wrote:

But then Sean Sexton rides them. We all know that dude goes hard, and if this rim doesn't hold up well for me, i couldn't imagine it would for him. There are others too, like Gary Young. Sure, he does a good bit of bowl riding, but then he goes crazy hard on street and other stuff.

Sean Sexton rides pretty smooth for a street rider. Maybe it wasn't the rim's fault.

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3/29/2015 12:30 PM

biggybuggy wrote:

Doesn't Dugan ride them? He lands straight. He's not side loading his rims a huge amount. Hawk runs em too I think. He land nicely and nails tricks.

MaximusBikes wrote:

But then Sean Sexton rides them. We all know that dude goes hard, and if this rim doesn't hold up well for me, i couldn't imagine it would for him. There are others too, like Gary Young. Sure, he does a good bit of bowl riding, but then he goes crazy hard on street and other stuff.

biggybuggy wrote:

Sean Sexton rides pretty smooth for a street rider. Maybe it wasn't the rim's fault.

Still, smooth or not, a drop is a drop.

I only ran it for a very short time and really didn't even give it my all. Mostly park and smooth street and stuff..

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/29/2015 12:35 PM

MaximusBikes wrote:

But then Sean Sexton rides them. We all know that dude goes hard, and if this rim doesn't hold up well for me, i couldn't imagine it would for him. There are others too, like Gary Young. Sure, he does a good bit of bowl riding, but then he goes crazy hard on street and other stuff.

biggybuggy wrote:

Sean Sexton rides pretty smooth for a street rider. Maybe it wasn't the rim's fault.

MaximusBikes wrote:

Still, smooth or not, a drop is a drop.

I only ran it for a very short time and really didn't even give it my all. Mostly park and smooth street and stuff..

Huh. I don't know. Sacrifice a virgin, ask Satan?

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3/29/2015 1:13 PM

biggybuggy wrote:

Sean Sexton rides pretty smooth for a street rider. Maybe it wasn't the rim's fault.

MaximusBikes wrote:

Still, smooth or not, a drop is a drop.

I only ran it for a very short time and really didn't even give it my all. Mostly park and smooth street and stuff..

biggybuggy wrote:

Huh. I don't know. Sacrifice a virgin, ask Satan?

logical. our dark lord has all the answers. good idea!

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/29/2015 4:47 PM

eskimojay wrote:

I'd imagine that rim would hold up fine if you where running like 100 or 110 psi

MaximusBikes wrote:

What is the reasoning behind this? Wouldn't it be better for the rim to use around 80? Obviously depending on your weight.

eskimojay wrote:

No 80 would make the rim more vulnerable to dents from casing big airs , the more rock solid the tire is the more protection for the rim

this. i've been running them almost a full season now. they're totally fine, nice and straight, but one little dent from a flat landing with low pressure

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3/30/2015 5:23 AM

They run them because that's what Odyssey is pushing at the moment. Odyssey is trying to show that so and so pro rides these rims and they hold up for them, so they will hold up for you, but they're not telling you that they're getting new rims for free whenever they need.

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3/30/2015 6:21 AM

They run that rim because they want to and it DOES hold up well for them.

Seriously although the headline weight number might make you think that it is not a strong rim, the weight savings have all been made through solid engineering design rather than the guessing technique that most of our competitors use. This is why the rim is such a radically different shape to the other Odyssey rims.

The fact that you complain of the wheel coming out of true makes me think that you just had your spokes a little loose. Most of the strength of a wheel comes from the spokes and running them a little loose will make a huge difference to the strength of the wheel. And of course if they are a little loose, they soon become very loose and then things are even worse.

The Aerospace actually has THICKER sidewalls than say the 7kA also.

I hope this makes sense.

smile
G.

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3/30/2015 8:51 AM

Gsport George wrote:

They run that rim because they want to and it DOES hold up well for them.

Seriously although the headline weight number might make you think that it is not a strong rim, the weight savings have all been made through solid engineering design rather than the guessing technique that most of our competitors use. This is why the rim is such a radically different shape to the other Odyssey rims.

The fact that you complain of the wheel coming out of true makes me think that you just had your spokes a little loose. Most of the strength of a wheel comes from the spokes and running them a little loose will make a huge difference to the strength of the wheel. And of course if they are a little loose, they soon become very loose and then things are even worse.

The Aerospace actually has THICKER sidewalls than say the 7kA also.

I hope this makes sense.

smile
G.

Thanks! It does make a good bit of sense.

I now run Hazard Lites front and back. I found that the spokes tend to stay tighter, longer, as compared to the Aerospace.

I guess It looks a little negative from my comments, it still is much better than the Primo and Shadow rims i have had.

Maybe it's the hub it was laced to, as it was not very nice and had different sized flanges. Which i have found also gives trouble in that.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/30/2015 9:59 AM
Edited Date/Time: 3/30/2015 10:00 AM

MaximusBikes wrote:

Thanks! It does make a good bit of sense.

I now run Hazard Lites front and back. I found that the spokes tend to stay tighter, longer, as compared to the Aerospace.

I guess It looks a little negative from my comments, it still is much better than the Primo and Shadow rims i have had.

Maybe it's the hub it was laced to, as it was not very nice and had different sized flanges. Which i have found also gives trouble in that.

Back pedal much? You bash a product hard in your initial posts. Continue to bash even after normal people claim to have ridden them with no issues. Then someone with a big name from the industry provides an explanation and you are now blaming the hub flanges and everything else.

If you don't like/don't believe in a product don't pussy out because someone told you otherwise.

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3/30/2015 12:04 PM

bobPA wrote:

Back pedal much? You bash a product hard in your initial posts. Continue to bash even after normal people claim to have ridden them with no issues. Then someone with a big name from the industry provides an explanation and you are now blaming the hub flanges and everything else.

If you don't like/don't believe in a product don't pussy out because someone told you otherwise.

Yeah, but you gotta realize I was pretty much completely delusional when i was posting this. I was real sick and had nothing but a bunch of nyquil and water in me. Rational thought was not really apparent.

I didn't bash it too badly, just stating the problems i did have with it. I did stand by those comments, i just considered his professional opinion.

The truing i could handle. It was like after every... idk like 4 riding sessions i found a hop or thing to true. I'm still not even the HARDEST rider out there. I'm not exactly butter on toast but I'm not so rough or burly that it should've happened. Lacing it was kinda hard but once i got it it wasn't all bad. If i can, i will post the crack on here to show you.

It's still not as strong as a Hazard Lite. I can vouch for that very much so. The rim while i was riding it FELT good, as it was very light and less rotational weight is always a plus.

But as i also stated, i still had less trouble with it than rims from other companies. Shit, i cracked a Primo Seven series a few times, minor cracks, but still it was only in the front and i kept it true pretty well. Along with the Stun rims. Which i may add aren't 110% terrible. None of the rims stated are. They all have their flaws, (except for the Hazard Lites, which i have had no issues with at all).

And as for "pussying out" i get how that looks, but i was considering a professional opinion, who i am willing to trust wouldn't lie to us all. It was laced to a Colony Wasp hub, which is garbage in comparison to the Ratchet hub i have now. Every single time i lace a hub with different sized flanges, it takes longer than one with the same sized flanges. Symmetry is ideal. Not just because of different spoke lengths, but probably due to how the tensions are bound to be different when you have to twist the hub in the process.

I stand by what I have said, as I'm sure a LOT of work went into the product, I was willing to entertain the notion that it may not have been entirely the rim's fault, but more of how it was made originally and the PREVIOUS owner.

I should also state that when i got it, it needed trued, and then i had spoke trouble so i got new ones and once it was laced again it did stay a little better, but not perfect, like i had hoped.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/30/2015 12:05 PM

And as for one last idea, why haven't they made one in 7000 series instead of the 6000? It probably would be much stiffer with the same design.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/30/2015 9:05 PM

MaximusBikes wrote:

And as for one last idea, why haven't they made one in 7000 series instead of the 6000? It probably would be much stiffer with the same design.

i guess they had to save money somewhere.

while i don't claim to be an expert on metallurgy, I believe 6000 is not necessarily a grade below 7000. if i'm not mistaken, 7000 series aluminum is stronger in a block and 6000 holds up better for longer pieces like tubing. i don't feel like going through google to find evidence tho. can someone do the legwork for me and post some links to info on this?

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3/30/2015 9:39 PM
Edited Date/Time: 3/30/2015 9:42 PM

fck it im bored. i did the research. http://www.bikepro.com/products/metals/alum.html

"The 6XXX group is alloyed primarily with both Magnesium and Silicon to make a moderate strength alloy

The 7XXX group is alloyed primarily with Zinc to make a high strength alloy."

aaannnd http://www.bikeforums.net/bicycle-mechanics/15193-6061-t6-vs-7005-aluminum.html

"6000-series is aluminum alloyed mainly with magnesium, and tends to be a bit more ductile (for instance, it would be more apt to wilt or buckle than to snap, compared to 7000-series).

7000-series aluminum is alloyed primarily with zinc. It tends to be harder and stronger but perhaps more brittle. Excellent material for chainrings due to its hardness, too."

so yeah, it looks like solid, smaller pieces hold up better with 7000 series aluminum because of its stiffness, but 7000 is more likely to crack when used in the hollow rim shape compare to the slightly more ductile 6000. that's why they use 6000.

it's the old dry stick analogy. if you take two sticks of equal length and diameter from the same tree, but one has been on the ground for days and one is fresh from the tree. while the dry stick from the ground may be stiffer, it will snap if you try to bend it. the fresh stick that still holds water from the tree will not be as stiff, but it bends before it snaps. 7000 is the dry stick, 6000 is the wet/fresh stick


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3/31/2015 3:28 AM

The first number is a reference to the alloying materials rather than strength, it is overly simplistic to think that 7000 is better than 6000 (or even 2000)
There is virtually no difference in stiffness between most alloys.

There are 7000 series alloys (such as 7075) that are much stronger than most 6000 series alloys, BUT there are also 6000 series materials that are significantly stronger than some 7000 series alloys, and even 2000 series materials (like 2014) that are way up there.

However, the strongest 7000 series alloys dont really lend themselves well to extrusion or welding, so 7000 series rims (and frames etc) tend to be made of 7005 or similar and there are 6000 series materials (such as the one we use for the Ribcage) which are much stronger than 7005.

With any materials selection choice there is always a lot more to consider than just the headline numbers.

I hope this helps.

smile
G.

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3/31/2015 10:08 AM

MaximusBikes wrote:

Thanks! It does make a good bit of sense.

I now run Hazard Lites front and back. I found that the spokes tend to stay tighter, longer, as compared to the Aerospace.

I guess It looks a little negative from my comments, it still is much better than the Primo and Shadow rims i have had.

Maybe it's the hub it was laced to, as it was not very nice and had different sized flanges. Which i have found also gives trouble in that.

bobPA wrote:

Back pedal much? You bash a product hard in your initial posts. Continue to bash even after normal people claim to have ridden them with no issues. Then someone with a big name from the industry provides an explanation and you are now blaming the hub flanges and everything else.

If you don't like/don't believe in a product don't pussy out because someone told you otherwise.

MaximusBikes wrote:

Yeah, but you gotta realize I was pretty much completely delusional when i was posting this. I was real sick and had nothing but a bunch of nyquil and water in me. Rational thought was not really apparent.

I didn't bash it too badly, just stating the problems i did have with it. I did stand by those comments, i just considered his professional opinion.

The truing i could handle. It was like after every... idk like 4 riding sessions i found a hop or thing to true. I'm still not even the HARDEST rider out there. I'm not exactly butter on toast but I'm not so rough or burly that it should've happened. Lacing it was kinda hard but once i got it it wasn't all bad. If i can, i will post the crack on here to show you.

It's still not as strong as a Hazard Lite. I can vouch for that very much so. The rim while i was riding it FELT good, as it was very light and less rotational weight is always a plus.

But as i also stated, i still had less trouble with it than rims from other companies. Shit, i cracked a Primo Seven series a few times, minor cracks, but still it was only in the front and i kept it true pretty well. Along with the Stun rims. Which i may add aren't 110% terrible. None of the rims stated are. They all have their flaws, (except for the Hazard Lites, which i have had no issues with at all).

And as for "pussying out" i get how that looks, but i was considering a professional opinion, who i am willing to trust wouldn't lie to us all. It was laced to a Colony Wasp hub, which is garbage in comparison to the Ratchet hub i have now. Every single time i lace a hub with different sized flanges, it takes longer than one with the same sized flanges. Symmetry is ideal. Not just because of different spoke lengths, but probably due to how the tensions are bound to be different when you have to twist the hub in the process.

I stand by what I have said, as I'm sure a LOT of work went into the product, I was willing to entertain the notion that it may not have been entirely the rim's fault, but more of how it was made originally and the PREVIOUS owner.

I should also state that when i got it, it needed trued, and then i had spoke trouble so i got new ones and once it was laced again it did stay a little better, but not perfect, like i had hoped.

How is the world would i realize you were "completely dilusional"? How do we know you are not completely dilusional right now? Stick to your guns bro, no one likes excuses...especially long winded ones.

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3/31/2015 10:15 AM

bobPA wrote:

How is the world would i realize you were "completely dilusional"? How do we know you are not completely dilusional right now? Stick to your guns bro, no one likes excuses...especially long winded ones.

Because I'm telling you I was at one point, and now I obviously am not. Its not really an excuse, just an explanation for why I was saying things.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/31/2015 10:29 AM

Velo/Raptor wrote:

fck it im bored. i did the research. http://www.bikepro.com/products/metals/alum.html

"The 6XXX group is alloyed primarily with both Magnesium and Silicon to make a moderate strength alloy

The 7XXX group is alloyed primarily with Zinc to make a high strength alloy."

aaannnd http://www.bikeforums.net/bicycle-mechanics/15193-6061-t6-vs-7005-aluminum.html

"6000-series is aluminum alloyed mainly with magnesium, and tends to be a bit more ductile (for instance, it would be more apt to wilt or buckle than to snap, compared to 7000-series).

7000-series aluminum is alloyed primarily with zinc. It tends to be harder and stronger but perhaps more brittle. Excellent material for chainrings due to its hardness, too."

so yeah, it looks like solid, smaller pieces hold up better with 7000 series aluminum because of its stiffness, but 7000 is more likely to crack when used in the hollow rim shape compare to the slightly more ductile 6000. that's why they use 6000.

it's the old dry stick analogy. if you take two sticks of equal length and diameter from the same tree, but one has been on the ground for days and one is fresh from the tree. while the dry stick from the ground may be stiffer, it will snap if you try to bend it. the fresh stick that still holds water from the tree will not be as stiff, but it bends before it snaps. 7000 is the dry stick, 6000 is the wet/fresh stick


That does make sense actually, i could see how the 6000 would make a better rim out of that shape. I have seen more 7000 series rims with trouble and nastier welds really too.

What's really the point of the 7000 series at all? The only other part, other than sprockets, i have had was just a (pretty awful) stem. I had like 3 from warranty after problem and problem. They slipped almost constantly. EVERY big drop the bars would move. It was that Ezra stem. It literally stripped out and sucked. 7000 was definitely an awful thing for gripping bars.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

3/31/2015 5:06 PM

ehh, its more popular in road and mountain bikes where there's suspension a derailleurs to keep things running evenly. they don't get beat up the way BMX bikes do so the stiffness translates to added efficiency and has minimal effects on strength. it's all about the application

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4/1/2015 8:10 AM

I have no idea what you are doing wrong, I have had an aerospace rim on both rims for over 2 years and I have had no problems. I usually don't even pump my tires on a regular basis, just when I feel they are too low, one time my psi was at 40 psi or so and rims are perfectly fine.

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4/1/2015 9:18 AM

bobPA wrote:

How is the world would i realize you were "completely dilusional"? How do we know you are not completely dilusional right now? Stick to your guns bro, no one likes excuses...especially long winded ones.

he had a bad experience with them, posted what he thought and asked for opinions as to why that happened. Then, people gave him information which he did not know before which educated him more on the issue. With the new information, he changed his stance on the rims.

Why is that such a bad thing? changing your opinion after getting sound information doesn't sound like "back pedaling" to me, it sounds more like being a logical thinker. if he was truly bashing the rims he would have continued saying bad things about them AFTER people gave him new information on the rims.

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4/1/2015 3:28 PM

xlilkillaluc15x wrote:

he had a bad experience with them, posted what he thought and asked for opinions as to why that happened. Then, people gave him information which he did not know before which educated him more on the issue. With the new information, he changed his stance on the rims.

Why is that such a bad thing? changing your opinion after getting sound information doesn't sound like "back pedaling" to me, it sounds more like being a logical thinker. if he was truly bashing the rims he would have continued saying bad things about them AFTER people gave him new information on the rims.

Thank you! Yeah, i like to have a good, logical BMX related conversation on here, so my opinion changing is just a result of new information.

I did crack it a bit on the weld, not so much to make it not rideable, but it is cracked.

Which i now realize isn't the rim's fault, just maybe a not perfect weld. Which is bound to happen.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

4/1/2015 3:33 PM

Gsport George wrote:

The first number is a reference to the alloying materials rather than strength, it is overly simplistic to think that 7000 is better than 6000 (or even 2000)
There is virtually no difference in stiffness between most alloys.

There are 7000 series alloys (such as 7075) that are much stronger than most 6000 series alloys, BUT there are also 6000 series materials that are significantly stronger than some 7000 series alloys, and even 2000 series materials (like 2014) that are way up there.

However, the strongest 7000 series alloys dont really lend themselves well to extrusion or welding, so 7000 series rims (and frames etc) tend to be made of 7005 or similar and there are 6000 series materials (such as the one we use for the Ribcage) which are much stronger than 7005.

With any materials selection choice there is always a lot more to consider than just the headline numbers.

I hope this helps.

smile
G.

Cool to know the Ribcages are 6000 series. I was always interested in that. TIL.

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4/1/2015 5:22 PM

bobPA wrote:

How is the world would i realize you were "completely dilusional"? How do we know you are not completely dilusional right now? Stick to your guns bro, no one likes excuses...especially long winded ones.

xlilkillaluc15x wrote:

he had a bad experience with them, posted what he thought and asked for opinions as to why that happened. Then, people gave him information which he did not know before which educated him more on the issue. With the new information, he changed his stance on the rims.

Why is that such a bad thing? changing your opinion after getting sound information doesn't sound like "back pedaling" to me, it sounds more like being a logical thinker. if he was truly bashing the rims he would have continued saying bad things about them AFTER people gave him new information on the rims.

MaximusBikes wrote:

Thank you! Yeah, i like to have a good, logical BMX related conversation on here, so my opinion changing is just a result of new information.

I did crack it a bit on the weld, not so much to make it not rideable, but it is cracked.

Which i now realize isn't the rim's fault, just maybe a not perfect weld. Which is bound to happen.

Get Sun rims.

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