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1/16/2016 10:03 AM
Edited Date/Time: 1/16/2016 10:03 AM

Please actually read this all the way through and keep an open mind

IN DEFENSE OF BMX

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Da Laird

unfuckwithable ill

Refs-brokenbmx, MaximusBikes, Brian_Griffin, Colonydirt94, Aebasher



1/16/2016 10:31 AM

It's long as fuck but FBM seems to hold it down.

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Instagram : braydenbuckingham
My Cult 2 Short

1/16/2016 11:17 AM
Edited Date/Time: 1/16/2016 11:36 AM

"A person who will learn about BMX from self-serving and arrogant YouTube personalities."


LOL

As for my opinion regarding the matter (copy and paste from another thread) :

I did some research and i kinda do understand why he would skip on dealers and distributors to bring in a cheaper bmx alternative.

The mark up on "good" bmx products from bmx shops in third world countries is ridiculous.

I had a lot of friends who rode Amity and UnKnown Bikes back home in the Philippines because they were a cheaper alternative. Before those brands closed anyway.

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In real life, i'm a short Perverted Azn Man.
But in the internet, i'm a killing machine with 10 years MMA training experience.

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1/16/2016 11:49 AM

There are some things I disagree with in this article, but I agree with most of it and of course respect other's opinions. Really that scenario example about "Little Johnny"; I feel just doesn't happen much anymore (it's like a perfect rare after-school TV special moment). I like to believe that most peeps getting into BMX now discovered it more independently, eventually fell in love/stayed with it, and then sought out it's cultured history.

Anyway if you ride BMX you owe it to yourself to read every bit of the article. I think it helps to have a snack to eat while reading it (that's what I did).

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"STREET" all day, ere'day.

1/17/2016 9:20 AM

"I wish we were big enough to indiscriminately spew resources, but at this time in BMX, we are far from that. We are NOT skateboarding " skateboarding is big because it is affordable parents can by their 12 year old a great board for less then 200 and not care if they on skate for one summer bmx in the other hand way more expensive so if I didn't ride I would probably push my kid towards a board because of the price and because kids loose interest in things fast. Other then that cheaper mafia bikes that are aimed at younger kids would do many things local shops would get tons of business from kids and parent who don't work on bikes( a lot of kids just take there bikes to the shop to have shit fixed or changed instead of doing it themselves) once they are in the local bike shop what will they do? Ask for the new bars hanging on the wall! Grips, tires, a bmx dvd whatever more business for the shop. Then if more kids get into bmx just because of directs mail bikes more people will see bmx maybe even be able to get a local park built where there are none indoor parks would make big money because riding in the cold sucks. Jams and competitions wouldn't disappear what kid would love to see the best local or even pro riders coms in and ride their local park. What's the downside if all bmx company's followed Mafia and places like dans and Albes would go under. I love dans ( mostly because in 8 years there has been only one local bike shop that that aren't dicks to the bmx crowd) but that's the way of the world

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1/17/2016 10:13 AM

The issue is, if loads of cheaper brands start going the direct sale route, or enough bigger companies. Shops wouldn't be able to compete and would stop stocking bmx parts. Bmx shops would close too. The industry is small enough as it is.
Chances are that won't happen because of one small cheap brand that no one seems to care about. But IF it did happen, access to bmx for kids just getting started would (potentially) dwindle away. If shops stop stocking bmx parts or bmx shops close down, who would put money into jams? Who would be there to support the locals?
It's bad enough having to buy parts online based on reviews and geometry without being able to have a proper look yourself imo.

The reason this has blown up so much is because of mafia and harry mains blatant disregard and disrespect for other companies/distro/shops by saying they're not needed. And they'll undoubtedly push that opinion on all the kids they're trying to sell to (buy from us, everyone else is ripping you off). I wonder what they'll do if loads of kids start asking for parts to be replaced under warranty? They could ignore them, maybe even close shop and start under a different name? It's happened before *cough*total*cough*
Bikes of similar quality have a crappy warranty as it is usually (mongoose, diamondback etc. If a bike is used for stunts, all warranty is void) and it's not like you can just take it into the local dealer.
It all seems a bit moody to me

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1/17/2016 4:33 PM

Oh wow.. yeah, I have seen this.

Let's be real, WHO HERE HAS NEVER ONCE OWNED A WALMART BIKE?

I sure as fuck did. It's no different. I had seven of those things probably. Broke them as I was learning things. It's part of it all. And let's also realize that the Mafia completes are sold on Amazon, the Walmart of the internet!

They are a shitty walmart bike made to look (to the untrained eye) like a REAL bike. They will NOT last, they will NOT be any good either. Not if the goal is to make a bike that's really affordable, even if they're doing that no distribution bullshit anyways. They may be (slightly) cheaper but they will be a LOT worse. So you know what'll happen? They'll break, get a bad reputation (as if they haven't already lol), and then they'll buy parts from people who deserve your money. It's a simple thing this, you're all losing your shit over nothing. Harry isn't even the biggest dude out there and most of the kids I know watch TCU and LZ anyways. It's all a silly silly battle you're worried about. Plus it's only a frame fork and bar and a bike that he's got anyways, they are not going to BLOW UP from that unless that frame is 2 lbs and indestructible, the bars cure cancer, and the forks set fire to your enemies. Come on guys.

I don't hate "Harvey Lo Mein" at all. I think he is being honest, most importantly. Imagine how terrible this would be if they kept it all secret and screwed the people out of it that way? I think his riding is incredible. Anyone that disagrees need's their eyes checked. I also think he is doing exactly what he wanted, and I will not fault him for that. If he wants to be famous and talented and has some different ideas from a different perspective, I will not give hate for that.

I do not agree with what you're seeing here. He is basically making walmart bikes with his name on em **cough cough.. mike spinner...** and nobody batted an eyelid from that. Not a single kid in his right mind bought one of those and progressed in a significant way and is still riding that bike. Stocksy started on one. He rode it, progressed, and broke it to fuck and bought a REAL bike. Like all the other kids will!

So don't be freaking out, BMX is strong no matter what, guys. We are here, thinking this, and doing this anyways.

Harry isn't wrong, and neither is Mike Hinkens. You have to take a step back to look at the whole picture here. It'll still bring some kids in who will end up buying better parts from real rider owned companies, in turn supporting BMX.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

1/17/2016 4:37 PM

But... isn't the whole reason Harry Main is joining Mafia is to help them improve their quality as well?

They could be a serious competitor in the near future.

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In real life, i'm a short Perverted Azn Man.
But in the internet, i'm a killing machine with 10 years MMA training experience.

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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(͡O╭͜ʖ╮͡O)

1/17/2016 4:46 PM

I also should state that this whole 21st Century idealism is dangerously stupid and I hope everyone that believes in it can fuck themselves.

If everyone is famous, nobody is. Got it? I cannot STAND how many "Youtubers" there are out there, and technically I AM ONE. But BethanyBMX does it for a different reason. Not to be famous, but to help the culture and document what we as friends do. Media is important. People LOVE watching videos when they can't or aren't riding, i'm one of them. And BMX is a big deal to us and we love helping kids and are still very much in tune with what BMX companies enjoy seeing. A "crew".

But Social media is a dangerously stupid thing right now. I think if everyone was a smart person, social media would create a beautiful new thing. But relying on the people to be smart is like wishing on a star, it doesn't work out.

People who set out to be famous are dumb, and the ones that do it nowadays are shit anyways. People ought to set out to be GOOD. Not a mere imitation of what others have done. The amount of followers you might have will not make your dick bigger, you sexier, or anything else. It's another made up place for people to hide and pretend. Which as i've stated would be good if people behaved. I hate to think that way, it's too negative for me, but it's the truth. They get on the internet hoping to connect to the whole world when really they're further up their own ass.

The new internet world is a joke anyways, (ironic i'm saying it on the internet). Shouldn't people be catching on by now? Not to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but the government is watching and marketing ALL OF THIS. They quite literally see straight into what people are thinking and doing and move straight into it. They no longer have to wait for a trend to become apparent, they just check tumblr or twitter and start selling stupid shit and putting new ads up. It's so capitalistic and wrong it hurts to think about.

As a generation, we're fucked. Brainwashed. These devices we use single us out. Make it so the government can do whatever they want anyways. They created a society where everyone is divided. Over a Facebook comment. Too many people are too into this whole thing to realize none of it is real anyways.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

1/17/2016 5:18 PM

Too much stress in BMX . We all ride bikes . He's making kids access bikes easier . 1 Mafia bike won't blow up a bike shop.

Let the bike shop fans continue supporting bike shops and let the kids get a decent bike for cheap that they like .

In the end , no kid will know how to put together a new bike or fix a blown bearing , they'll go to shops anyways for that ..

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Instagram : braydenbuckingham
My Cult 2 Short

1/17/2016 5:27 PM

one try kid wrote:

But... isn't the whole reason Harry Main is joining Mafia is to help them improve their quality as well?

They could be a ...more

That's a big joke if you ask me. I'm hoping I'll be pleasantly surprised and they will at least have a sealed BB. But something tells me the completes won't be that good...

As for the signature frame fork and bars, they will be the same, maybe cheaper, but that's not gonna blow up anything, ONE set of nice parts will not fuck the world of BMX. Everyone isn't gonna ride the same exact things!

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

1/17/2016 5:30 PM

It's not about mafia at all or low end bikes. It's his attitude and the way he basically told "the world" about how everyone is getting ripped off and distributors and bike shops shouldn't exist in an essence just because he gets paid from bigger sponsors and not by a shop or distro. He's basically saying fuck any of those people even though they are a huge backbone in the bmx community.

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Da Laird

unfuckwithable ill

Refs-brokenbmx, MaximusBikes, Brian_Griffin, Colonydirt94, Aebasher



1/17/2016 5:35 PM

Ricked_Em wrote:

It's not about mafia at all or low end bikes. It's his attitude and the way he basically told "the world" about how everyone ...more

Yes, it has a bit to do with that. The consumer is more important than the stuff that he does or says. Kids will be riding those bikes to start and then buying BETTER parts. Not Mafia's.

But I agree it is rather crap to do it all the way he has. Being a professional means understanding that it's really stupid to drop your sponsors in a shitty vibe. Super weak in my opinion, but he is making his decision.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

1/17/2016 5:36 PM

one try kid wrote:

But... isn't the whole reason Harry Main is joining Mafia is to help them improve their quality as well?

They could be a ...more

MaximusBikes wrote:

That's a big joke if you ask me. I'm hoping I'll be pleasantly surprised and they will at least have a sealed BB. But ...more

I'm sure ther bikes will good quality but if I was a parent who knew nothing about bmx a 300-400 dollar on Amazon would make me worried so I would go to a shop to get a professional opinion or take my kid to a local park on his current bike and ask some of the locals what's good and what to look for I doubt many before Mafia riders are going to buy or recommend their parts and I've always bought my parts off what I know about the company or if I had rode someone else's bike with the same parts so a brand that no experienced riders have would make me skeptical of them without the current bmx community backing them they won't ever get big enough to have any effect unless bigger company's follow suit with direct sales

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1/17/2016 5:44 PM

MaximusBikes wrote:

That's a big joke if you ask me. I'm hoping I'll be pleasantly surprised and they will at least have a sealed BB. But ...more

So negative... tsk tsk tsk...


I for one am hopefully Mr Main does well in his endeavors.
And if he is, imagine buying a full chromo everything complete instead of a hi-ten low end complete for the same price.

Kinda helps guys who are good enough to break low end completes but too poor to afford high end stuff.

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In real life, i'm a short Perverted Azn Man.
But in the internet, i'm a killing machine with 10 years MMA training experience.

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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(͡O╭͜ʖ╮͡O)

1/17/2016 7:15 PM
Edited Date/Time: 1/17/2016 7:17 PM

Read Harry's statement on his site. Not sure I agree with this assertion:
"... I will make BMX more affordable... because I think that's why not enough kids are getting into the sport."

Hate to question him, cause it seems like he's trying to promote this move as more than self-interested and in that sense it's a good example.
But (and these are not my views but how I think general perceptions about it are):

1. It's already the cheapest of the specific-purpose branches of cycling, no? The quality one can get for the amount of money spent vs. other types of bikes' typical costs is staggering
2. Parents who think about things are likely to view the bikes themselves as either too limited in purpose to be worth the investment or
3. Representative of a discipline that's too risky, or has bad connotations, some of which are valid and some of which are overblown.

Until the industry starts making a case for itself vs. other types of bikes, it will never broaden the walls of its niche, IMHO. It's sad, but affluent folks will walk into a shop and see a brightly colored "mountain bike" or road bike and assume that the quality is superior because it looks clean and shiny and so does he person who typically rides one.
The industry knows this, and I'm guessing here much more profit can be made from those than BMX.

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Frmrly BmxBos
Ref: Robinson79, aaron.samuel.green

1/17/2016 10:19 PM

1234q9 wrote:

I'm sure ther bikes will good quality but if I was a parent who knew nothing about bmx a 300-400 dollar on Amazon would make ...more

For the quality, I would not hold your breath.

Remember veinbmx? I bought SO MUCH SHIT from them because of how cheap and all the sales and stuff. Their bikes were not up to par with the other completes, although their 700-800 ones were amazing quality.

A shit ton of people had em. Bent the backend on a Silo frame, and a Dorado or whatever it was. It's caused a bit of a stink among shops and mail orders though! But they're not even around (sadly) anymore. They were just the leftover Eastern products when you got down to it though. At a fraction of the cost. I miss that site though, I loved their customer service. I got like three front hubs for free and a few sets of forks after destroying the Amber ones and an Ezra stem or two.

But you know what percent of parts I broke from them? 100% They were cheap. (except for my beautiful Guerra Moose frame, that thing was sex)

It's all a matter of how they handle it, if they are good quality, GOOD. Something tells me from their latest line up that they won't be any game changers is all. If it works out the way it should though, i'm more than happy for them.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

1/17/2016 10:35 PM

Charliekeet wrote:

Read Harry's statement on his site. Not sure I agree with this assertion:
"... I will make BMX more affordable... because I ...more

I disagree, BMX is still expensive. It's like saying "well i bought the cheapest ferrari in the line up" It still cost 150 grand lol

It's something kids get into, whereas more adults do mountain and road biking, therefore they can justify spending that kind of money on a bike. I personally wouldn't do that. I'd buy a Fairdale Taj probably since those look fantastic and still pretty fun and agile for a cruiser type thing. Plus It's not THAT expensive. Which I dig.

For us, (assuming you're in your teens or twenties, like me), we have jobs that clear 1500$ a month and have enough to support a bike and many other things. But for the little dude starting out, his parents probably can't afford much.

My first bike I paid mostly for for myself. I cut grass for a few months and did gardening and weed eating. My mom gave me 100$ and that was that. Ever since then I've been very independent for my bikes. I knew that I had to work to play. Some kids can't as easily, nor should they all HAVE to. It's still important to work, but maybe not as hard as I had to to keep my bike rolling.

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References: OneGuyIlluminatiEye, robinson79, Brian Griffin, The Horror Contact, StoreBoughtChild, C_Johnsonbmx, dkTechEthan, etc.

1/17/2016 10:40 PM

I remember when my mom and I struggled so much so didn't get a tube for a couple months because we had better things to do with our time and money . I'll never take that for granted . Cheap bikes is a solution . It's not going to kill bike shops . We all want cheap things financially . I remember a 400$ United RN1 being "expensive" ... Now I'm ordering 600$ frames ..

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Instagram : braydenbuckingham
My Cult 2 Short

1/18/2016 12:15 AM

Brayden_Buckingham wrote:

I remember when my mom and I struggled so much so didn't get a tube for a couple months because we had better things to do ...more

It's always important to look at things from this perspective. It can bring up a goid point, which kids need this to get into bmx?

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1/18/2016 8:40 AM
Edited Date/Time: 1/18/2016 10:26 PM

Charliekeet wrote:

Read Harry's statement on his site. Not sure I agree with this assertion:
"... I will make BMX more affordable... because I ...more

MaximusBikes wrote:

I disagree, BMX is still expensive. It's like saying "well i bought the cheapest ferrari in the line up" It still cost 150 ...more

Compared to other bikes though. things have to cost some amount of real $ for them to be any good, cause if they do the manufacturer keeps profit from it and is able to continue & innovate, and if they don't they are junk and the way the company carries on is by a shitload of volume of that junk for pennies. So how much cheaper could the stuff we actually want to buy really be?

But I'm skeptical that there's that big a market of buyers who are 1. Kids who are savvy enough not to buy what's in Walmart but 2. Willing to spend close to the amount needed to get quality bike or parts from mail order or LBS.
idk maybe the cost of these things mafia will pump out is so much lower without the retailer involved that they can WAY undercut everyone else & I just don't get it.

Lol sigh I wish I were that young. I'm a bunch older than you, but thanks, that's like when I get occasionally carded at the liquor store. tongue I have two kids & i prob shell out what you make a month just for rent [Edit: I'm saying this sucks, believe me!]. But i still know now the pain of not having an extra $ to spend on a part or repair & having to wait, or DIY it.
I just don't think the sport needs a cheaper bike as much as it needs a bigger mainstream presence and that means taking away $ from middle-of-the-road "mountain" bikes with crappy shocks etc that look like they are more bike to parents but are really not.

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Frmrly BmxBos
Ref: Robinson79, aaron.samuel.green

1/18/2016 8:42 AM

Oh and btw I agree that Fairdale Taj looks stellar! I was looking at their site other day and I need to get my hands on one of those.

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Frmrly BmxBos
Ref: Robinson79, aaron.samuel.green

1/18/2016 9:31 PM

MaximusBikes wrote:

Yes, it has a bit to do with that. The consumer is more important than the stuff that he does or says. Kids will be riding ...more

i agree with the professionalism bit there. drop sponsors, throw everyone under the bus, and make a bunch of disrespectful comments? how to become an industry pariah 101. plus it's childish. i did careful research before buying mine, have no doubt it'll break as i progress, then i'll get better parts. for now it was all i could afford. no bike and a dream, or the best i could get for now? parents need to be responsible on their own, and not just get whatever, then throw their kids out to play. besides, when you're first starting you prob don't need a 1k custom with all the best parts available. would i have bought a mafia? no, because i didn't like harry main's approach and attitude.

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I can't upload a photo for my sig. it's that guy puking really hard, except it's coming out of his ears and eyes, too. just imagine that instead of this text. oh look, there he is now!

1/18/2016 9:56 PM

Ricked_Em wrote:

It's not about mafia at all or low end bikes. It's his attitude and the way he basically told "the world" about how everyone ...more

MaximusBikes wrote:

Yes, it has a bit to do with that. The consumer is more important than the stuff that he does or says. Kids will be riding ...more

deepdiarrhea wrote:

i agree with the professionalism bit there. drop sponsors, throw everyone under the bus, and make a bunch of disrespectful ...more

What did you get?

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1/19/2016 10:41 AM

biggybuggy wrote:

What did you get?

mongoose legion l100. (NOT the wal-mart line. i know people give mongoose a hard time because of wal-mart. i worked there three years third shift...i don't even buy toilet paper from them to wipe my ass).

really liked the specs for the price. 289 for full chromo, pivotal seat, sealed bearings, etc. not bad to start off with.

drooled over all the bike's at dan's comp though :D

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I can't upload a photo for my sig. it's that guy puking really hard, except it's coming out of his ears and eyes, too. just imagine that instead of this text. oh look, there he is now!

1/19/2016 11:44 AM

Charliekeet wrote:

Read Harry's statement on his site. Not sure I agree with this assertion:
"... I will make BMX more affordable... because I ...more

You can get a good quality MTB and a decent road bike for around equal to a high end complete. There is a difference in those worlds though, MOST people buy completes in MTB and ROAD and upgrade IF they need to *usually a saddle and tires and grips are main components upgraded*

And the completes in ROAD and MTB can EASILY clear thousands, there are WAY more levels of completes in those aspects, so it is incredibly difficult to compare. Many offer the same frame but you get an upgraded shifter or brakeset, and it is a new level. BMX doesn't really have it where you get a new sprocket and brakes and your bike is an elevated level.

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"Hey anybody ever make that mistake like right when you wake up in the morning and you believe in yourself?" -Kyle Kinane

"BIKES!" -Tom Segura

1/19/2016 11:52 AM
Edited Date/Time: 1/19/2016 12:01 PM

Bmx is a lot cheaper when you compare it to other disciplines of cycling. Yeah you can buy an ok road bike off the shelf for £1000, but you could spend more than that on a wheelset. You can't buy a downhill bike worth having for less than a couple of grand. For less you could build your dream bmx.
I know that's still a lot for a beginner, so I get harry mains point about helping kids get into it. But if that same kid decided to buy an mtb he could spend 300 on a bike and it would be pretty terrible. There's already plenty of good beginner, full chromo, sealed bearing bmxs on the market for similar money. If a kid buys a mafia online, who is he asking for advice about which is better, or better suited to him? If he walks into a shop and asks about the bikes they stock, they'll be able to point out the differences and suggest the bike suitable for his needs (who really likes buying blind off the Internet?). I don't think mafia care about supplying good bikes, hopefully harry main will have some input and help them get better, but I think their main goal is to use harry to market their product and sell, sell, sell.

I've already worked on a couple of mafia bikes. Not too bad as a beginner bike in all honesty. One thing I'd say is they're very gimmicky. Calling an 18" bike kush is a bit irresponsible imo, and the blackjack comes with that horrible khe affix gyro that no one can get parts for anymore.

Edit: I just went on their site. All hi ten frames and forks, no mention of sealed bearings. Just descriptions that will appeal to people that don't really know what they're looking at. Yes they're cheap, but no better than any other cheap bmx on the market. And a similar price.

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1/19/2016 12:28 PM

Photo
Here you go. Mongoose scan r50, £199.99, available from Halfords (like a department store that sells auto spares and camping stuff. Generally has a fairly bad name for itself, but there's always at least one person that knows a bit about bikes. Usually at least one person that either rides or rode bmx, from my experience. There's one in pretty much every large town in the UK). 10 quid more than the best mafia, pretty much the same spec. Looks better too imo, with the added bonus of being built in store by someone trained to build bikes, a free 6 week service, and somewhere you can physically take it if you have any issues, which will be covered under warranty for the first year. They also have (or had, haven't looked in a while) a full chromo diamondback with sealed everything for about £300. They stock radio too, which is the sister company of wtp. They don't carry parts (apart from gusset and halo), but for those you'd want to support your local independent anyway.
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